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【翻译】一条喜欢组铁桶队的歪果鱼对铁桶队的论述

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综述:那些对铁桶队威胁很大的精灵们导致了铁桶队结构一成不变


1楼2015-12-23 07:44回复
    Not sure what you are necessarily talking about here, sorry. Stallbreakers actually don't provide much counterplay options to stall... that's why they are effective stallbreakers. Yes, you do have options for beating common stallbreakers / wallbreakers, they place many constraints upon stall teams when building, keeping the builder from being very creative with the team concept or mons on the team. That is why we see common team archetypes like [Mega Sableye / Ferrothorn / Clefable / Starmie / Hippowdon / Talonflame], or [Mega Venusaur / Chansey or Clefable / Heatran / Slowbro / filler / filler], or [Mega Charizard X / Hippowdon / Ferrothorn or Skarmory / Mew or Slowbro / filler / filler], etc. It is not that common stallbreakers necessarily beat stall teams, it is the restrictions they place on teambuilding that is the problem because they end up limiting the creativity and variety of stall. The biggest issue with stallbreakers is that you are often not able to compound counters to the common stallbreakers. Take Mega Medicham, Manaphy, Mega Gardevoir, and Gengar for example. More often than not, a stall team will have the following framework in order to beat the aforementioned stallbreakers (however, stall teams are not built around this framework, it just naturally falls into place): [Mega Medicham psychic type counter or m sab / Manaphy set counterplay 1 / Manaphy set counterplay 2 / Mega Gardevoir steel type counter or chansey / Gengar counter]. Because each of these stallbreakers often require their own dedicated slot on stall teams, stall will end up falling into common archetypes. However, there are a few ways around this that I know of (if you can think of any other mons that can compound these slots, I would love to hear about them). Mega Scizor can counter both Mega Gardevoir and Gengar, and Chansey can fulfill both Manaphy counter 1 and Mega Gardevoir counter (although Chansey isn't necessarily the best Mega Gardevoir counter).
    Please don't think I'm trying to convince anybody that these stallbreakers / wallbreakers need to be suspected (also, I don't know what the argument before this was about, I just got tagged and read littlelucario's post). I just thought that I would point out that stall doesn't have many options when dealing with stallbreakers / wallbreakers, but a well built stall team should have sufficient counterplay to the common stallbreakers / wallbreakers.
    e: i mean stallbreakers as a whole restrict stall, not necessarily individual stallbreakers.


    2楼2015-12-23 07:52
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      破盾精灵实际上并没有给消耗队留多少选择空间,正因如此他们才是有效的破盾精灵。
      没错,你的确有一些破解常规破盾精灵的办法,但他们(这些精灵/破解方法)对你组消耗队造成了很大限制,迫使组队者无法选择创造性的思路和精灵。
      这就是为什么我们经常看见这样的模板队伍:
      【Mega 宝石鬼 / 草钢 / 皮可西 / 宝石海星/ 砂河马 / 烈箭鹟】
      【Mega 妙蛙花 / 吉利蛋或皮可西 / 火钢 / 呆河马 / 两个自由位】
      【Mega 喷火龙 X / 砂河马 / 草钢或钢鸟 / 梦幻或呆河马 / 两个自由位】等
      破盾精灵并不总能击败消耗队,但他们对组队的限制影响了消耗队的创造力和变化性。
      关于破盾精灵的问题,最大的问题是你常常不能用一个精灵来反制所有常见破盾精灵。
      以Mega瑜伽王,玛娜菲,Mega沙奈朵,和耿鬼为例,往往一个消耗队会使用如下组合以击破上面的破盾精灵(当然,消耗队不是围绕这些组合建立的,大家都懂)
      【克制Mega 瑜伽王的高耐久超能系或者Mega宝石鬼/
      玛娜菲制裁者一号/
      玛娜菲制裁者二号/
      克制Mega沙奈朵的钢系精灵或者吉利蛋/
      耿鬼制裁者】
      因为每个破盾精灵都要求消耗队交出一个PM位置给他,使得消耗队最终模板化。
      当然,我还知道一些小伎俩(如果你知道更多请告诉我):
      Mega钢螳螂同时反制耿鬼和Mega沙奈朵,吉利蛋同时胜任玛娜菲制裁者1号和沙奈朵制裁者的位置(尽管吉利蛋不是最好的沙奈朵反制者)
      请不要觉得我是试图说服任何人,说这些破盾精灵应该被禁用(我也不知道你们前面在吵啥,我只是被@出来的),我想我只是指出了消耗队并没有很多的选择,但一支组的很好的消耗队应该可以应对常见的破盾精灵。
      补充:我的意思是“破盾精灵”这个整体限制了消耗队,不单只某些个体。


      3楼2015-12-23 08:24
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        译者按:这篇东西讲了歪果鱼的铁桶阵为什么是这个样子,具有一定参考价值。
        如果尝试击破铁桶阵,可以从这篇文章里提出的常见的“破盾精灵”和“破盾精灵的反制精灵”入手,通过微调配招或者一些两三只精灵的小套路来增加击破的机会。
        胜利属于多想一步的人。


        4楼2015-12-23 08:29
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